Legislature(2003 - 2004)
03/31/2003 03:17 PM House L&C
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
HB 148-LAND SURVEY STANDARDS Number 0055 CHAIR ANDERSON announced that the first order of business would be HOUSE BILL NO. 148, "An Act instructing the State Board of Registration for Architects, Engineers, and Land Surveyors to adopt minimum technical standards relating to the practice of surveying." Number 0070 PETE FELLMAN, Staff to Representative John Harris, Alaska State Legislature, presented HB 148 on behalf of the sponsor. He noted that HB 148 is an effort to address problems with land surveys. He testified that various types of surveys are done for banks, title companies, and real estate companies. He said that people who know what they want [in a survey] are generally happy with the results. However, for people who are not well versed in land surveying, they may overpay or they get surveys that aren't accurate or don't satisfy the bank or real estate company. Mr. Fellman noted that the surveying industry as a whole maintains very high standards through organizations such as the Alaska Society of Professional Land Surveyors, which is affiliated with the American Congress on Surveying and Mapping. He gave several examples of how the industry is concerned about doing a professional job. Number 0276 MR. FELLMAN noted that in Alaska, the governor appoints the members of the Board of Registration for Architects, Engineers and Land Surveyors. The board sets the minimum standards for surveyor testing, required schooling, and experience. Housed in the Division of Occupational Licensing [in the Department of Community and Economic Development], the board adopts regulations, makes licensing decisions, and takes disciplinary action against surveyors who violate the law. MR. FELLMAN, noted, however, that the board has not set minimum standards for an actual survey, and that is the intent of HB 148. He said he researched [survey laws in] 26 states, and only one state did not have minimum standards for surveys. He said he is working with Patrick Kalen, director of legislative affairs for the Alaska Society of Professional Land Surveyors, who is presently in Colorado at a convention addressing national minimum standards. Mr. Fellman conveyed Mr. Kalen's interest in incorporating these national standards into HB 148. Number 0484 REPRESENTATIVE GATTO asked Mr. Fellman about [March 29, 2003] correspondence in the members' bill packets from [Jim Colver, Surveyor] who wrote that the American Land Title Association already has standards for surveys that must be followed for title insurance. MR. FELLMAN replied that there are standards for title insurance, but the standards are not in statute. The industry has a very good system in place, but Alaska's board has not adopted any standards. He stated that the industry tries to present itself in a professional manner, but that doesn't mean [every surveyor acts professionally]. REPRESENTATIVE GATTO asked if each title company makes up its own standards. Number 0565 MR. FELLMAN said in practice there are important variations between types of surveys. Sometimes title companies and banks specify what should be included in a survey report; other times, they depend on the surveyor to decide what to cover in the work product. Some surveys locate corner posts, section lines, and easements; other surveys show septic tanks, buildings, and other improvements. REPRESENTATIVE GATTO asked why a surveyor might object to this bill. MR. FELLMAN replied that if he were a surveyor, he would not object to promoting high standards for the industry. Number 0662 REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG asked for examples of problems with surveyors' work. MR. FELLMAN said he did not personally know of any problems. He said Mr. Kalen had told him that the lack of formalized norms for surveying in Alaska leads to undesired results, and he supported the sponsor taking this action. Mr. Fellman said he doesn't want people paying for [elements of] a survey they don't need or want. REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG asked if there might be different kinds of surveys approved rather than a uniform survey. MR. FELLMAN replied that Mr. Kalen said that if HB 148 states a minimum standard for surveys, he may not be able to provide a simple section line survey. By allowing the board to adopt a standard, then professionals are making the determination [about what type of survey is appropriate]. Number 0817 REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD asked what this bill does about bad surveys. He asked if current state law makes a surveyor liable for a bad survey. He described his experience of buying into the Rabbit Creek Heights and Rabbit Creek View subdivisions where the original survey was flawed. The municipality platted the subdivision, he bought title insurance, then several years later learned that the surveys were all bad. The landowners cannot sell the property because they cannot acquire title insurance on it. He asked if HB 148 does anything about double- checking a surveyor's work. MR. FELLMAN said a citizen can complain to the board, which can take a surveyor's license. Mr. Fellman said he was only familiar with this recourse. REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD replied that the surveyor did lose his license in Alaska, but that didn't help any of the homeowners. He said the bills for new surveys are running into the hundreds of thousands of dollars for each property owner. He said he wondered how frequently this happens. The surveyor should be liable for these costs--not the homeowners. Number 0983 MR. FELLMAN said perhaps the board should consider requiring surveyors to have liability insurance and bonding. REPRESENTATIVE CRAWFORD said he would like the bill's sponsor to address the problem of faulty surveys. Number 1014 REPRESENTATIVE ROKEBERG asked why there is no testimony from the board or from the Alaska Society of Professional Land Surveyors. MR. FELLMAN said that Mr. Kalen [who is a member of the board] is out-of-state at a surveyor's convention. CHAIR ANDERSON noted that Mr. Colver, the surveyor who sent an urgent email opposing HB 148, is not present to testify today. MR. FELLMAN, responding to a question from Representative Rokeberg, noted that Representative Harris wishes to have the committee hold the bill. REPRESENTATIVE ROKEBERG noted that it's important to hear from board members about the bill. Number 1123 CHAIR ANDERSON said that public hearing on HB 148 will be kept open and that the bill will be held over.
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